DSM-G600, DNS-3xx and NSA-220 Hack Forum

skip · 2009-04-16 09:22:07

hello,

i've been considering running the fun_plug in my dns-323 and to that end reading the forum here.

i have a v 1.04 unit that was running RAID1 with 2 750GB (Seagate?) drives. i thought i'd be "smart" and backup my data first, so i got another 750GB drive (this one a WD). i did the following procedure hoping to have the unit backup my data onto the new drive for me:

1. removed both drives
2. installed the new drive and had the web ui format it for me.
3. put one of the original drives back in (thinking it would just try to sync the two)
4. the web ui didn't seem to recognize that my old drive had been in the bay previously and i was asked to set up RAID1 fresh. this wiped both drives. bummer
5. got a hd enclosure with firewire and plugged it into my macbook pro. installed an extension that allowed me to read the ext2 drive.
6. rsync'd the data back to the 323

i'm wondering what my best options are for proceeding. i'm thinking i'd like to swap the new drive with the 2nd original drive so i have identical drives in the 323. since the drive was originally in there as RAID1, if i just pop it in and boot the 323, will it be smart and just think it's in RAID1 and all is normal?

if not, what are some options?

i'm hoping when all is said and done i will have a working RAID1 323 again and also a good backup. then i could go forward and upgrade to v 1.06 and install fun_plug.

i'm new to NAS/RAID/ffp but i have unix experience so i'm fairly sure i can achieve the right results if i have a little direction from some of the more experienced users on the forum.

i thank you all for any pointers!

Skip

mig · 2009-04-16 10:22:17

IIRC, there is a partition change in the disk layout between the FWv1.04 and the FWv1.06 so
you are going to want to format your drives after FWv1.06 is installed.

One way to accomplish your goal:

1) get you data on the WD705GB drive (the backup you originally wanted)
a. setup the DNS-323 as a single drive with the WD 750GB
b. rsync your data from the Seagate 750GB (on macbookpro) to the DNS-323 (single disk WD 750 GB)
c. (optional) verify the data is correct [because you'll need to wipe the Seagate 750GB later]

2) remove the WD750 GB from the DNS-323 and upgrade the firmware to FWv1.06 with no disks

3) setup the DNS-323 as a RAID1 with the pair of Seagate 750 GB drive, make sure you format the drives
(this will wipe all data from the Seagate 750s)

4) Install FFP v1.05

5) rsync your data from the WD 750GB drive (on macbookpro) to the DNS-323 (RAID1 with Seagate 750 GB disks)

It's a lot of transferring of data, but I think it will get you what you want in the end.

skip · 2009-04-16 12:06:02

that sounds do-able and time's not an issue, data integrity is!

one question: what is/are some standard ways of verifying the data on a disk?

i greatly appreciate your help!

Skip

fordem · 2009-04-16 17:21:39

First - swapping drives in and out of a DNS-323 in a RAID1 configuration is a really bad idea - as a matter of fact, swapping drives in and out of any RAID1 device is a bad idea. Best case scenario the unit will assume that the drive being swapped in is a replacement for a failed drive and format it.

In your case when you removed the drives and formatted the new one, you also removed the RAID1 configuration.

mig · 2009-04-17 00:45:10

skip wrote:
one question: what is/are some standard ways of verifying the data on a disk?

I'm not sure about macOS utilities. I like beyond compare v3.0 (http://www.scootersoftware.com/download.php)
but that only runs on windows or Linux. You could try a recursive diff?

bq041 · 2009-04-17 01:16:50

Fordem is right, very bad idea to be swapping drives regularily on the DNS; there are configuration files on the drives and in flash that can get very screwed up. You best option in your scenario (3 drives) is to use usb-storage.ko and connect one of the drives via the USB port to make the backup to.

skip · 2009-04-17 02:00:39

i have parallels running win xp on my laptop so i will check out Beyond Compare.

i didn't go as far as diffing all files (i've got about 400 gigs on them) but i did a du -ks and a find . -type f | wc -l and came up with good results. a few missing files but after looking at my rsync output i see that it couldn't read a few files. and those files weren't that important to me.

now comes the complete newbie and stupid statement:

i thought RAID1 was exactly for what i was doing... i thought it was meant to reduce downtime by having redundancy. so, if a drive failed, you would simply limp along on the other until you replaced the bad drive. in the real world, how do people USE RAID1? if 1 drive does fail, what do they do? what do us owners of the DNS-323 do?!

or! was it because my RAID didn't *think* the removed drive was broken and thus got really confused when i pulled it?..

once i get this all settled i plan on taking everyone's advice: installing the ffp and usb-storage.ko and doing backups that way and not fooling around with working drives when not necessary!

thanks for continuing to help me out with this stuff. i may "grasp" it at some point.

Skip

fordem · 2009-04-17 03:30:50

If you were using RAID1 for redundancy, you would/should not have been swapping the disks around - you would have left it alone until a disk failed, and at the earliest opportunity replaced the failed disk with a new one and allowed the array to rebuild itself - that's how RAID1 is used in the real world, and that's how my DNS-323 has operated in my RAID1 disk failure simulations.

In your case you destroyed the RAID1 array when you removed the disks and replaced them with a single disk and formatted that disk - at that point you had no RAID1 and no redundancy so the unit would never have attempted a rebuild.

Now - for the sake of discussion - assuming you hadn't destroyed the RAID1 array - perhaps you powered the unit down, removed the disks and inserted a previously formatted disk, which the unit somehow recognized as belonging to a RAID1 array (which is not very likely), when you inserted the disk with the data, the unit should format the last disk inserted, wiping the data, and then rebuild from the existing disk.

mig · 2009-04-17 05:10:24

skip wrote:
i thought RAID1 was exactly for what i was doing... i thought it was meant to reduce downtime by having redundancy. so, if a drive failed, you would simply limp along on the other until you replaced the bad drive. in the real world, how do people USE RAID1? if 1 drive does fail, what do they do? what do us owners of the DNS-323 do?!

Here is how I see life with the DNS-323...

The DNS-323 is a very nice, compact, energy efficient, dual drive NAS (computer) that runs a "rock solid" Linux OS.

D-Link created a webGUI to "help" customers with common tasks like drive setup, user/group setup, samba, ftp, ntp and well...,
D-Link really didn't get all the the problems with the webGUI worked out. The webGUI does actually work for a small set of operational
conditions, but customers are always trying new things (like swapping around RAID1 drives) and the webGUI code does not
account for these unanticipated conditions. Instead of doing nothing, the webGUI often does the wrong thing (like formatting a drive
with data). ARRGH!!!

So, how can you live with this limited functioning webGUI? Well you have a couple choices:

1) Go buy another NAS with a more capable webGUI. (Qnap, BuffaloTech and Synology all make more capable webGUIs
but, be prepared to pay more $$$ than the DNS-323 - there is always a cost for convenience)

2) Only perform operation that the webGUI can handle. It is hard to know which operation are "reliable", but reading this forum and the
official D-Link forum can help identify which operations return undesired results.

3) Just, do NOT use the webGUI.
You can install FFP and gain command line access to your DNS-323, and manage your disks with 'mdadm', manage you own user and
groups, customize your 'smb.conf' file to provide the SMB features you want. Add additional packages to manage time (ntp) and fix time
zone issues, or stream media (Twonky), or Btorrent (Transmission/Clutch). With the help of this forum, all this is possible -- and more!

You will have to learn about Linux (you already said you have some unix experience), you will have to learn about the capabilities of 'mdadm'
(the software that manages the RAID), and you will realize, what you originally set out to do [swaping RAID drives] - is possible, just NOT with
the D-Link webGUI.

Since, you do have your data backed-up, before you commit the data to your DNS-323, take some time to develop a working disaster recovery plan.
Put some data on the DNS-323 and 'simulate' a drive failure, see if you really get an email notification? practice rebuilding the RAID1 with 'mdadm'.
(or the webGUI, if you trust it?) Make sure you understand how you and your DNS-323 reacts to various failure conditions, so there will be no surprises
if (when?) a drive really fails. And, ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS keep a backup!

It all begins with FFP (Fonz Fun Plug).
Good luck, ask a lot of questions, someone is always willing to help on this forum.

Last edited by mig (2009-04-17 08:17:32)

skip · 2009-04-17 08:46:02

you guys rock.

when i bought the thing i didn't even think about getting into the "nuts and bolts" of it, but now i'm excited to get the most out of it. i've been working with unix and linux for 15 years as a software developer, always relying on the sys admins for this kind of stuff. time to put on a new hat and dig in.

i really appreciate all your help (and i'm sure i will be asking more questions down the line). maybe i'll even be able to answer someone else's question in the future.

thanks all!

Skip

DSM-G600, DNS-3xx and NSA-220 Hack Forum

Announcement

#1 2009-04-16 09:22:07

backup idea gone wrong

#2 2009-04-16 10:22:17

Re: backup idea gone wrong

#3 2009-04-16 12:06:02

Re: backup idea gone wrong

#4 2009-04-16 17:21:39

Re: backup idea gone wrong

#5 2009-04-17 00:45:10

Re: backup idea gone wrong

skip wrote:

#6 2009-04-17 01:16:50

Re: backup idea gone wrong

#7 2009-04-17 02:00:39

Re: backup idea gone wrong

#8 2009-04-17 03:30:50

Re: backup idea gone wrong

#9 2009-04-17 05:10:24

Re: backup idea gone wrong

skip wrote:

#10 2009-04-17 08:46:02

Re: backup idea gone wrong

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